Meanwhile, outside Guadalajara, Mexico, pilgrims flocked to stand before a gas pump on which the image of Harry Potter cleaning his glasses appeared over night.

It has also been reported, at a Borders store in Indiana, that a Harry Potter book was seen assulting a copy of Hillary Clinton's book, "Lying History", and then turned the book into a 'Discounted Item'!

Is it true that Harry Potter is being drafted by the Democrats to run for President in '04? Is he a Vietnam Vet? Or has he had an abortion?

Curious minds mant to know.

W. Willie: Are you sure they said 'Harry Potter' and not 'Hairbrained Pot-head', Bubba Clinton?

LET me comment on the H.P. phenom, especially "muggledom":
The human spirit is created to yearn for the supernatural. That's a given - God set in us a desire to see the natural overridden (not by brooms!) by the supernatural. That's why everybody loves Hallowe'en who doesn't know of its satanic origins, or doesn’t see the need to honor Christ. I used to ADORE the all-black "Headless Horseman" picture in my first grade reader. (Try to imagine!) I LOVED the Gypsy doll in the Nancy Drew mystery that was warm - supernaturally WARM...Oh, it thrilled and chilled my spine, but that was BEFORE I saw the blind see, the lame run, the deaf hear, the homosexual freed from those chains, and the drug addict INSTANTLY sobered up and delivered, all in Jesus' Mighty Name. (People I KNOW, by the way!) WOW! The REAL THING - Jesus - puts Mickey Mouse magic in the shade by miles and miles. Of course, with satan's magic, there ARE thrills, and no consecration or change is required, but his magic is NO help whatever when you're flat on your back with a fatal disease or in an airplane plummeting to earth. Only those who follow the Savior of the whole world, and each person who CHOOSES Him get THOSE kinds of rescues.
As to Muggles: the author Rowlings, who is satan's strategist here on earth, not so deceptively relegates those of us who refuse to delve in or operate in the Black Arts because of our love for and dependence on Jesus, relegates us (as I said) to an unpleasant, mean, stupid group of society - just short of wearing the yellow star - to be looked down on, to be sure, as very undesirable. Well, she’s got a HUGE thing going, and the results of discrimination against Muggles (us) will soon be felt as little kids sneak off and practice their newly-learned witchcraft (which God REPEATEDLY forbids in His Word) and become more “donkey-eared and donkey-tailed” by the minute (with apologies to Pinnochio).

BOOKS OF THE TIMES | 'HARRY POTTER AND THE ORDER OF THE PHOENIX' (NYTimes)
For Famous Young Wizard, a Darker Turn
By MICHIKO KAKUTANI

(From last 2 paragraphs) It's as if the boy next door had been miraculously transported from the Muggle world we all know to a magical realm where dementors and thestrals lurk, a world where people can pour their extra thoughts into a "Pensieve" or whisk themselves from one place to another with a Portkey. ..........
As this volume, like its predecessors, attests, Ms. Rowling has imagined this universe .....The wizards, witches and Muggles who live there share complicated, generations-old relationships with one another and inhabit a place with traditions, beliefs and a history all its own — a Grimm place where the fantastic and fabulous are routine, but also a place subject to all the limitations and losses of our own mortal world. ..(My addition here: All the while this frollicking generation - starting in SECOND GRADE, mind you! - plumments into an all-encompassing downward spiral of evil, which drags them toward the hopeless black eternity of hell. D.)

Who cares?? Get a life!!

"It's all the hype that your money can buy"
FIF

H.o.D.

JK Rowling is a Satanist? Hmm. I just thought she wrote entertaining books about kids who are magical. About kids overcoming odds and whatnot. Stuff that other kids love to read. I don't think the books are about Satan, I think they're about living and have no religious tones whatsoever. But hey, that's just me.

hrdlordi,

I care. And have a life already, thank you very much.

Your brevity is exceeded only by your eloquence and use of tags.

Angie,

A bit of study by yourself on witchcraft, satanism and the other occult subjects will give you a background of information which you can compare the Potter books against and actually SEE the obvious similarities that are otherwise invisible to the unknowing observer.

But that is only if you wish to better understand dian's post. If not, see hrdlordi's advice.

"Don't be fooled. That light at the end of the tunnel may be an oncoming train."

Attentioning here to
Dian and Okie Dokie,

You ladies obviously punched Harry potter into Google and came up with this website to peddle your blather. Are you part of a movement? (See B.M.) Itís a kidsí book. Go to church (not the one you two women got married to each other in) but a real honest to God church and talk to a minister who can explain to you that there is no problem with children thinking about magic. My daughter loves the Harry Potter movies and doesnít believe in any of it. You do.

Satans' greatest trick is his ability to make you believe he doesnít exist. But you have to know who he is first. Maybe heís like Santa ClausÖHeís your father. Or look inside, he may be there.

Muggles??? To quote the great philosopher hrdlordi, get a life.

So sorry. Sometime just get pissed off.

I read the first Harry Potter book because I like to know what my children are reading. I've read the rest of the series because they are entertaining.

Sure those evil themes bother me...you know, ones like do the right thing even if it's not the easiest, stand up for your friends, and fight evil. Horrible ideas to be teaching to children, aren't they?

To make it all even worse, I like Halloween too. I know about its pagan (not Satanic) background but that doesn't stop me from celebrating the holiday any more than it stops me from decorating Easter eggs or celebrating Christmas in winter instead of spring.

Didn't like Harry Potter?

What about Alice in Wonderland?

How about Snow White and The Seven Dwarfs?

HOw About any of the Grims Fairy Tales?

How about the Illiad? Any Greek or Roman Mythology.

How about Easops Fables?

I guess that leaves out Moby Dick, Treasure Island, Ali Baba and the Forty Thieves.

Oh yes, Shakespeare wrote about witches and spells too.

I am assuming that you have a passing aquaintance with these classics.

Just thought that a book where kids can pretend to be able to overcome and GETS THEM TO READ REAL BOOKS might be a positive thing here.

So, when does the 6th book come out?

i thought for sure we would see eve on this thread, as she knows the ghetto, inside and out. where are you eve, we miss your insight.

LilKimIl,

Little girl, just for grins, what church are you referring to? From your comments following that statement, it would be entirely too confusing to guess. Oh, and tell your buddy frenchfry I said hi.
You're the one with fetish about your backside, aren't you?

Mikey,

You obviously assume too little, too late. What else do you assume?
The whole Oh, if you don't like this you must hate literature. thing is really lame man. If that's all you've got for input OK. Thanks for sharing and the warm fuzzy about the kids reading.

marybeth, you are such a cool mom. Warm fuzzies for everyone. Minimalization is such a handy thing don't you think? Goes good with milk too.

If anyone actually knows anything about the subject, I would be glad to hear what they have to say about it. Otherwise save the booksellers' rhetoric and quotes, I've already read it in the news too.

Reread the story that starts this little column of replies and try to get it this time, OK?

Okie dokie & Diane,

I'm not sure what's really bothering you about this Harry Potter hype? The content of the books with talk of wizardry, or the media's hyping and the public's soaking it up.

As to the content, perhaps you should read it with an open mind as the Vatican has. Or haven't you heard that the Vatican has endorsed the series. That doesn't happen very often, does it? My 10 and 7 year old have read all of the books and don't have any trouble discerning between what the Bible teaches and the entertainment of reading fiction. I like to credit good parenting for that one.

As to the media's hype: at least they're touting it as what it is, fiction. That book by the anti-christ herself, Hillary Clinton was supposed to be taken as all factual. Besides, it's what America is all about; Freedom of speech plus Free Markets. Don't forget about the Free Will given to us by God.

Your opinion is respected but demagoguery hurts the cause.

Idiots. If Harry Potter's covert allegories are disturbing, it's because they're decidedly Christian.

Did you actually read the books? Remember the bit where a phoenix (symbol of rebirth after death; medieval allegory of Christ) cries into Harry's wounds to redeem him? Or the bit where Harry calls on (read: prays to) an ethereal white guardian (read: cherubim angel) to protect him from Voldemorte (read: Satan)? Did you notice the extensive trinity allegories: Harry, Hermione, and Ron; Hagrid, Dumbledore, and McGonagall; Malfoy, Crabbe and Goyle... What about the obvious references to the Song of Solomon during the Wyrd Sisters' concert -- not to mention that Harry's luckless date is named "Cho" (do I need to explain the reference to "Job?"

Have you forgotten the part where Harry uses a (spiritual) map and a cloak of invisibility (that is, of God's sublime mercy) to help him escape his professors (secular humanists) and find the magic mirror of Esired (Salvation in the End Times) in which he sees his dead parents (Yahweh the Father and Mary the Mother) waving at him (blessing his immortal soul)?

These books are practically a retelling of the New Testament. What a horrifying world we live in.

-JS

Idiots. If Harry Potter's covert allegories are disturbing, it's because they're decidedly Christian.

Did you actually read the books? Remember the bit where a phoenix (symbol of rebirth after death; medieval allegory of Christ) cries into Harry's wounds to redeem him? Or the bit where Harry calls on (read: prays to) an ethereal white guardian (read: cherubim angel) to protect him from Voldemorte (read: Satan)? Did you notice the extensive trinity allegories: Harry, Hermione, and Ron; Hagrid, Dumbledore, and McGonagall; Malfoy, Crabbe and Goyle... What about the obvious references to the Song of Solomon during the Wyrd Sisters' concert -- not to mention that Harry's luckless date is named "Cho" (do I need to explain the reference to "Job?"

Have you forgotten the part where Harry uses a (spiritual) map and a cloak of invisibility (that is, of God's sublime mercy) to help him escape his professors (secular humanists) and find the magic mirror of Esired (Salvation in the End Times) in which he sees his dead parents (Yahweh the Father and Mary the Mother) waving at him (blessing his immortal soul)?

These books are practically a retelling of the New Testament. What a horrifying world we live in.

-JS

RE: the occult value of the Potter books. This is suspect, considering one of the most renowned Christian theologians of this century also wrote a series of "occult" fantasy novels, to wit: the Chronicles of Narnia. Geez, much of Christian tradition is an adaptation of Pagan themes.

RE: the Potter hype, three words: an AOL/Time-Warner property. I remember when the first movie came out, shortly after 9/11, CNN was doing interviews with kids coming out of the movie theater as news was breaking in the Afghan invasion.

Schlif,
I'd love to see you do that to the X-Men comic books. You clould probably pull some amazing "parallels" out of thin air (I figured that was a little politer than saying: out of your a**). But it is a bunch of non-sensical drivel.
(Of, wait. You left out the part about the school meals appearing magically, like manna from heaven.)
Wizards and magic are recurring themes in human literature. Take a look at the "Epic of Gilgamesh" sometime.
Saying that Harry and his are evil is foolish. What's the difference between "evil magic" and a "miracle"?
Nothing but your opinion of the person doing it.

Remember, the first Yeshua's first miracle was water into wine.
Party on, Jesus.

I think an old quote works well here: "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" (Obviously this is a Pre-Clinton saying)

Hey all the controversy aside, i think Ozzy should read the new Harry Potter books, and do the soundtracks for all the upcoming movies. and you guys that think that Harry Potter is too occult for kids should agree with that too, seeing as how you probably also think that Ozzy is the Devil. Truth be told Ozzy isnt the Devil and Harry Potter isnt too occult for kids. Fight the real evil, the teletubbies!

Clowns.

Circus clowns.

Evil incarnate.

*shudder*

>>>As to the content, perhaps you should read it with an open mind as the Vatican has. Or haven't you heard that the Vatican has endorsed the series. That doesn't happen very often, does it?

If you've read the news the last several years, it seems the VATican endorse's child molesting by their own priests! It doesn't make THAT right, does it ILIA?

>>>Don't forget about the Free Will given to us by God.

Your opinion is respected but demagoguery hurts the cause.

Posted by: ILIA on June 22, 2003 11:39 PM

Sure GOD gives free will, and doing the WRONG thing will send you to HELL! Ever 'play' with a Ouiga Board? Many people have been drawn into the occult by playing with one. Milton Bradley used to make them, parents thought them harmless too! Before you dismiss the things of Satan, remember he is real, as is GOD, and loves it when people laugh off his power, or when people under estimate him!

Angel,
Milton Bradley is demon of 6th level. Catholic priests same-same as imps, ruled by evil VATican. America is great satan, you no hear this?

Okie Dokie,
Story starting column of replies is satire. Reread it ownself and try to get correct this time. There you grin now?

Dian,
BOOOO!!!!

SRG
Don't you to clown around concerning that. You may be hitting head of nail. Open unholy worm can. WOOOOOOOÖ.

Oh, wait! I left out the part about the school meals appearing magically: manna from heaven, anyone?

It's so obvious, even a Muggle could see it.

-JS

Oh, wait! I left out the part about the school meals appearing magically: manna from heaven, anyone?

It's so obvious, even a Muggle could see it.

-JS

Angel,

You certainly missed the point about an "open mind". No, the Vatican never "endorsed" child molestation by their own priests. In fact, the pervasive covering up of the problem was due, in large part to the very type of close minded thinking that you obviously posses.

And implying that playing with a ouiga board causes people to become devil worshipers is a stretch at best.

Do I believe in God. Yes.

Do I believe in Satan. Yes, and in fact, I believe a small part of him got elected Senator from New York a few years ago. But, using my own free will, I have rejected him and all his works.

As I said before, demagoguery hurts the cause. You alienate those who would otherwise side with you and lose credibility with those you are trying to persuade.

Think about it.

Sorry ILIA, I didn't realize that you were one of those people, who's opinion is the only right one. Thanks for pointing out that anyone who dissents from your opinion is wrong. At least you didn't say shut up. --------------YET!

I find it both funny and frustrating that a book written for children (young teens) is causing such a furor.

Funny, in that there are people so foolish as to think that this is a big Satanist plot.

Frustrating that there are people so bloody stupid as to believe that this is a big Satanist plot.

And as for the "parallels" between Harry Potter and Christianity, more crap. Yes, I've read the Narnia books (not very good), and yes they were full of Christian imagery. What do you expect? It was done deliberately by (oh, what a suprise) minister.
The fisrt Potter book was written for two reasons. To entertain, and to make the author money. These are the two main reasons that any novels get written. If the first one fails, then the second fails as well, and then if there are any other reasons for the writing (to teach, to warn, to sermonize) that fails as a matter of consequence.
1984 and Animal Farm have very important social messages. They are also entertaining, and made piles of money.
The Narnia Chronicles must be entertaining (not my cup of tea, but so what, they've been selling for decades), they've made large piles of money, and they were intended to contain lots and lots of Christian imagery.
The Harry Potter books are very entertaining, and have made J.K. Rowling richer than the Queen of England. Any Christian imagery is purely your imagination. Basic core values are deliberately included: bravery, loyalty, hard work, fair play. And the books are written in such a way as to not include (and thus not offend), any major faith.

And like any good book, you get out of it what you put into it: If you go in looking for Christianity, you find it. Those looking for evil, won't find it themselves because they are too stupid to read, or have given up taking in any information aside from whatever narrow minded demagogue they listen too.

SRG

You're dead on, Thank you.

Angel

See, my opinion isn't the only one that's right.

Is that the way you react every time you can't respond to the point? You should realize that it only makes your opponents point stronger.

We're probably on the same page on most things, but you should stop taking yourself so seriously. If you can't then maybe you should just... no I won't say it.

There is a dangerous lack of diversity in the world of Harry Potter. It is interesting to note that the only non-white character present in the HP books is an elf (modeled suspiciously like Jar-Jar Binks in the movie). Thus, all people of color are made to feel as the "other". Where are the wizards of African, Asian, or Hispanic ancestry? Where are the gay or lesbian sorcerers? And why the blind adherence to the blatant sexism that dictates that males must be wizards and females witches? This is truely damaging to the self esteem of girls, particularly in light of the emphasis on the witch/wizard's emphasis on a "wand" -- a blatant phallic and, therefore, male-centric source of power.

Of course, everyone in the religous right who claims that "Harry Potter" is satanic is a complete nut who doesn't know what they're talking about.

I hate to say this, but what's the big deal? IT'S JUST A KID'S BOOK SERIES! It was written because the author needed money. I don't happen to like the series (I prefer books like Upgrading and Repairing PCs, Structured Assembler For IBM Microcomputers, Microprocessor Architecture, Programming, and Applications with the 8085, etc.), but why try to find reasons that the books are satanic or christian? It's a waste of time.

Sorry, just couldn't resist putting that picture in. Hey, I'm not calling it satanic or anything.

No picture, sorry. I put the IMG tag in, but it didn't post. Oh well, take a look at the picture here.

Agent X,

Time for the affirmative action. Am wanting much forward to see Korean Gay Lesbian witches here. Female wizards are making mouth much watery. Now must go.

There are asians, and blacks everywhere in Harry Potter. The chaser on the Gryfendor team is black, as is stated in the fourth book, and so is Dean Thomas, as is said in the first. The simple fact is, that these minoritys dont exist in as large numbers in Britian as they do in the US, minoritess are, on percent, fewer, and with three main characters out of a fairly scaled down cast a minority, i think it does a very good job.

There is also no mention of any of the adults' sexual orientation. One may assume that Mr. and Mrs. Weasley are hetero, but that is about it.
Any indications of orientation on the part of the students would class the movie as child porn, and get the books banned.

No doubt the porn industry is, or has, made some sort of film with at least a nominal resemblence to Harry Potter.
*nudge, nudge, wink, wink*
(if anybody out there knows about it, let me know)

Aside from all that...Agent X, terrific satire of the Lefties required inclusiveness stance. It always reminds me of the second Robocop movie when they loaded his program with so much crap.

>>>SRG

You're dead on, Thank you.

Angel

See, my opinion isn't the only one that's right.

Is that the way you react every time you can't respond to the point? You should realize that it only makes your opponents point stronger.

We're probably on the same page on most things, but you should stop taking yourself so seriously. If you can't then maybe you should just... no I won't say it.

Posted by: ILIA on June 24, 2003 10:05 AM

You just proved my point, ILIA! SRG, has told other people to 'shut up', so if this is who agrees with you, it only proves I was right, you two, believe everyone has the right of free speech, (as long as people agree with you)!

"Congress shall make no law ... abridging the freedom of speech..."
I am not an agent of the Federal government, so I can tell people to "shut up" if I think they are talking nonsense.
Yes, you have the right to free speech. You can express your opinion all you want.
I am equally free to express my opinion of what you said, and so is Ilia.

So, shut up!

No one has to believe anything.

No one has to accept things they can't see or want to believe.

(Although it does make radioactivity especially dangerous!)

Things of a spirtual nature are just that.

If your belief system does not include:

1.
Ultimate Good = God
Ultimate Evil = Satan

2.
They are both real and both actively involved in their individual cause right here on earth, right now.

Then these matters really make no difference to you one way or another. Refer to list until clear.

Alice came to a fork in the road. 'Which road do I take?' she asked.
'Where do you want to go?', responded the Cheshire cat. 'I don't know.' Alice answered.
'Then,' said the cat, 'it doesn't matter.

Lewis Carroll , "Alice in Wonderland"

I just wanted to hear from someone who had some knowledge (i.e. more than a random belief or "really strong feeling about") of witchcraft, satanism, etc. etc. (refer to your new age handbook for more) and could discourse on my observations utilizing logical, rational argument.

That's all.

Just awaitin' and ahopin'.

:)

Agent X: "Where are the wizards of African, Asian, or Hispanic ancestry?"

Angelina Johnson, Lee Jordan, and Dean Thomas are black. Padma and Parvati Patil are Asian, as is Cho Chang. The Hogwarts student body is about as diverse as any English school.

"No matter where you go, there you are."
--Buckaroo Banzai

"A sufficiently advanced technology will be indistinguishable from magic."
--Arthur C. Clarke

Call it "psionics" if you want. The incantation, the wands are just focusing mechanisms for exterting mental power. Are the wizard folks just in possession of a rare combination of genes?
People like Hermione coming from Muggle families indicate that it may be a set of recessive genes that may be carries by anyone, but need to be double reinforced. This also shows why there are "halflings" like Tom Riddle. The existence of "squibs" indicate that the trait may be a set of genes rather than a single one.
The ability to do "magic" or use a psionic power, may also have a large psychological component. For example, Neville Longbottom has the genetic component from both parents, yet has difficulty with the simplest of spells. He is capable of doing "magic" yet the results often come short of the intended goal. He is seriously lacking in self-confidence due to his family circumstances.
Another example that tis magic may be simply spionic powers is the so-called Imperious Curse in which the victim's own will is submerged in the one casting the "curse." The victim is "bewitched" into doing whatever the caster wishes. Harry Potter's nearly successful resistence to the "curse" is indicative that the power comes form the mind of both persons, and not some mystical external source.

After all this gibberish, why do I feel as if there is a college student somewhere planning on doing a thesis on this subject? Even worse, they will treat it as a serious scholarly subject, and not the joke that intended it to be.

Alas. I weep for the future.

scum randum gay, you seem really mature, so, shut up yourself, muyyahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

Good v Evil or no in the books you've got to wonder if the world loves them so is the world duped by the righteous tombs or does it just love what the world always loves, a lie dressed up with a little powered sugar.

Rowling has been deemed an inkling along the lines of Christian C.S. Lewis or Christian J.R.R. Tolkien by more than one commentator. An inkling, hmmm? I wonder what Lewis and Tolkien would advise Miss Rowling about her live in boyfriend?

Ken Stein - Do you have trouble sleeping? Your choice in books seems to suggest such. Though you might think likewise of my choices. :-)!

Srg,

BEWARE OF THE GREASE PAINTED ONES...

Clowns are evil....

Don't be decieved.

Professor Abronsius
Fearless Vampirekiller and Clown Removal Specialist serving the greater Slovenia Area

No, I have no trouble sleeping. I am actually a serious geek though, as you can probably tell from the list I gave. I do read other books, mostly stuff like Star Wars, Battlefield Earth (and no, I'm not a scientologist or L. Ron Hubbard worshiper), and Tom Clancy novels (Without Remorse, The Hunt for the Red October, Clear and Present Danger, The Sum of All Fears, The Cardinal of the Kremlin, Debt of Honor, Executive Orders, Rainbow Six, The Bear and the Dragon)

"Well, once again we find that clowning and anarchy don't mix." -- The Tick

BEWARE OF THE GREASE PAINTED ONES...

Clowns are evil....

Don't be decieved.

Professor Abronsius
Fearless Vampirekiller and Clown Removal Specialist serving the greater Slovenia Area

Posted by: Professor Abronsius on June 26, 2003 01:27 AM

http://www.ihateclowns.com/

Dian smith , I agree with you on the scripture and Harry Potter...Now I know I am old, but,I do have an opinion and have probably lived longer than most of you.You have my permission to call me a Bible thumper too.I know what the Word says and I for one think this would be a much better world if we all lived by it.

So does anyone know when the next book is coming out?